PWG Presents "Self-Titled" on Friday, October 6!

Pro Wrestling Guerrilla Discussion

Postby noah_ther » Mon Oct 02, 2006 10:50 pm

I guess the real point of all this is, will this match put butts in the seats? It seems like at least a good handful of folks aren't going to break their neck to make it to this show b/c of the time and location so at this point will a handicap/intergender first blood, tampon on a pole match make any difference? Hell, if it wasn't for the tag matches this would be a below average card for PWG, not bad necessarily, but just by comparison with past PWG shows. Oh and if they don't finally turn TJ heel at this show, they might as well quit booking him, cuz' he's on a treadmill right now. That being said, who's bringing their Chasyn Rance t-shirts, signs, dolls, and limited edition bobbleheads to the show on Friday?
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Postby SoCalAndy » Tue Oct 03, 2006 12:14 am

Jade could be Jaguar fuckin' Yokota -- her abilities aren't the point. Handicap matches suck. I would say that, as wrestling fans who have seen a lot of them, we know that.


That's just a matter of opinion. Handicap matches can be good if done well. I thought DX vs. Big Show and The McMahons from that WWE PPV was really good. I don't think Jade's talent inside the ring will make the match better or worse, but at the same time it's hard for me to say that because we don't know what role she is going to play in the match.

Besides, Petey's had a decent match or two in PWG -- the Sabin match, for example. I don't like him, and I don't want him back, but his hurting a card is no more of a guarantee than an intergender handicap First Blood match.


I thought the match with Sabin was weak. Him being on a card would obviously hurt a show, and we know that by now after seeing him on shows. We can't say the same about Frankie vs. Sky and Jade though. I already explained that above, so I wont get into it again. If I think the match sucks, I'll be the first to come on this board and say it flat out sucked.

All that stuff could be done in a straight-up First Blood, or a no-DQ match, or a bunch of different stips. Jade could interfere in any number of types of matches without her being an actual participant.


A singles match with a stipulation wouldn't help the feud advance. A singles No DQ match in PWG usually signals the end of a feud. Plus she was forced into the match when she tried to kill Frankie. It makes a lot of sense to see her forced into the match instead of just having her continue to be Sky's valet without being punished or giving Frankie a chance at getting back at her.

Well, if he doesn't try to bust her open, why the fuck is she in the match? That's a pretty weird justification for the booking.


He could simply beat her up without having to make her bleed without facing and type of punishment, and make Sky bleed, thus killing two birds with one stone.

Give me a break -- we're all making assumptions here.


You're making assumptions that the match wont do anything to help Frankie, and you don't know that. I'm just trying to be rational here.

I think we all assume that the tag title match will be great, that the Cape Fear match will be great... you've gone on record as assuming that Rocky/TJ will be great (which I agree with). I'm *assuming* that the handicap match will suck, for reasons I've stated.


We're talking about our thoughts about what the match quality will be like based upon what we've already seen and know about. You were talking about how Frankie wont get over because of a booking move you don't agree with. Big difference. Lots of people most likely don't share the same thoughts and opinions as you, and they most likely wouldn't have a problem with Frankie going after Jade and trying to make her bleed. Do you know what everyone in the crowd will want to see that night? Most likely you don't, so you can't say thinks like "Frankie isn't going to get face heat" and "are we really supposed to root for Frankie to cut open a woman" without knowing what people think which is something I have a problem with. I don't see anything wrong with you talking about how you think the match will suck though, I have no problem with that.

To use an extreme example, if somebody had shat on DDP/Arquette vs. Jarrett/Bischoff beforehand, would you have intervened with, "You shouldn't say that, you don't know what will happen"? Even if Arquette wouldn't have won, it still would've sucked, yes?


I probably would of shit on the match because I'd know that the quality would be terrible seeing as it has two wrestlers who I think suck, a guy who doesn't even wrestle on a regular basis, and a Hollywood actor. I wouldn't try and speak as if I know how the fans will feel about it though.

Saying "you can't know what will happen" is certainly technically correct, but condemning speculation impedes discussion.


Trying to assume what a crowd will or will not cheer for isn't a good way to try and get a discussion started.

You seem much more interested in snuffing out discussion than starting it.


See, this is what I mean when I say that you're assuming things about people when you don't know what their mindset is. That wasn't my goal at all, I was just trying to prove a point that you can't say the things that you're saying when it comes to crowd heat.

In the end, I don't care about whether you think the quality will suck or not. I just think saying like "are we really supposed to root for Frankie to cut open a woman" without knowing what people think before it happens is extremely stupid.
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Postby onlxn » Tue Oct 03, 2006 12:46 am

If I think the match sucks, I'll be the first to come on this board and say it flat out sucked.

Fair enough. And if the booking works well, I'll be the first to come on the board and say it worked well.

you can't say thinks like "Frankie isn't going to get face heat" and "are we really supposed to root for Frankie to cut open a woman" without knowing what people think which is something I have a problem with. I don't see anything wrong with you talking about how you think the match will suck though, I have no problem with that.

We simply disagree on this point. I don't see much difference between anticipating the quality of a match and anticipating the reaction of a crowd -- if the former is kosher, I don't know why the latter wouldn't be. In the same way that you learn what to expect from certain workers, you learn what to expect from certain audiences, and having attended most of the shows the company's run, I don't think the PWG crowd will much care for a match with these stips. You can disagree with that -- you've probably been to as many shows as I have -- but it'd be bizarrely oversensitive of you to be offended by my speculating on it.

And I agree with noahther: TJ needs a full-blown heel turn, badly.
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Postby cspariah » Tue Oct 03, 2006 10:22 am

noah_ther wrote:I guess the real point of all this is, will this match put butts in the seats?


It's one of the main reasons I'm going. I like this feud. Jade, Frankie, and especially Scorpio consistently entertain me.
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Postby shyboy13 » Tue Oct 03, 2006 2:31 pm

cspariah wrote: I like this feud. Jade, Frankie, and especially Scorpio consistently entertain me.


I agree. This match is one of the matches I am looking forward to the most. Frankie Kazarian is already one of the best wrestlers in the US right now. I think Scorpio Sky can possibly make it as the X-Division champ if/when he finally gets the chance sometime in the future and Jade Chung is a rare female in the industry who can quite easily become a WWE Diva or a TNA knockout when she finally gets her big break. It is my personal opinion that this match will be one of the best on the card. Hey, everyone is entitled to his or her opinion.

Ok, now that I have added my 2 cents, I think I would like to say something a bit more important. I really believe that PWG listens to its fans. I truly believe this. If I am correct, then wouldn
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Postby It's A Bomb » Tue Oct 03, 2006 3:02 pm

The problem with people on this board who are being critical of PWG's product is that they're criticizing the most trivial and retarded shit. The people who say negative things about PWG's product are a very small protion of the fanbase and can't speak for the majority of PWG fans. People need to realize that criticism isn't the best solution for helping PWG right now, because in my mind PWG is doing awesome at the moment.
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Postby onlxn » Tue Oct 03, 2006 3:24 pm

So says the dude who started a thread about how shitty one of PWG's workers is. And to reiterate, I fuckin' hate Petey. But it's silly to pretend that I'm the only one who criticizes aspects of the product.

PWG is indeed doing awesome at the moment, but we all have little things that bug us, and here's as good a place as any to discuss them. The promotion isn't going to be jeopardized by occasional criticism by some nyrdz on a message board, especially since those nyrdz all love the promotion and support it financially.

Switching gears... do people think this is really going to be a six-match card? They haven't advertised other guys appearing, as they normally do, but it seems like they might add another undercard match -- I can only really see the two tags and maybe Rocky/TJ going long...
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Postby BMH55 » Tue Oct 03, 2006 3:57 pm

onlxn wrote:
Switching gears... do people think this is really going to be a six-match card? They haven't advertised other guys appearing, as they normally do, but it seems like they might add another undercard match -- I can only really see the two tags and maybe Rocky/TJ going long...


I can see Necro Butcher doing a surprise match, but I can't come up with a name of who he could go against.
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Postby TigerDriver98 » Tue Oct 03, 2006 4:44 pm

Necro is wrestling in Texas on Friday. I don't think this is the kind of show for "big name" surprises in the first place, considering the mixed reaction a few people are giving it. But hopefully Necro will be back for All Star Weekend 4 though. I noticed Necro had on a BOLA shirt when he returned to IWA:MS on Saturday. Which was pretty cool.


Anyway, I can see some kind of 6-man being added. Disco Machine, Nemesis, Bino Gambino seem likely for that. Hopefully we see some debuting or returning local talent to fill out the other spots.

I saw Los Luchas, Charles Mercury, Lil' Cholo and Tommy Williams in AWS last Saturday, they looked pretty sharp (even with completely mismatched opposition in Los Luchas' case) So I wouldn't mind seeing any of them back in a 6-man.

As for debuts, while the region has seen better days. I'm sure there is two or three names that would fit in. (Though I've heard others on this board disargee) one wrestler I'm fan of is Ryan Drago. Who was in the first PWG match ever, and has been appeared in FIP, TNA and ROH within the last year. His match with Koslov was one of the sole bright spots of the dreadful WPW Best Of The West 2006 tourney. Also had the match of the night with Jay Lethal on the somewhat infamous FUSION show a few years ago.

Only online footage I can find of Drago is this music video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UU2K-0iPe7c

I'd like to see him get another chance. Perhaps in a tag team with Hook Bomberry or something.


Also jumping ahead, it'll be very interesting to see what PWG does talent wise on October 21st. As it looks like all the TNA guys are at a Fan Fest, which will remove Sabin, Shelley and possibly Kazarian. Several of the part timers (Colt, Aries, Strong, Sydal, Delirious) will be at a show in Florida, Necro in IWA:MS and of course Kevin Steen in Dragon Gate.

Leaving a little bit of a hole in the roster. We know Hero will be there, which probably also means Claudio. Which is great, but I wonder who else PWG will come up with for that show. But this is a topic for next week I reckon...


Oh also, I totally agree with whoever said that TJ Perkins should turn heel at this show. Perhaps they can turn a negative into a positive and use his being pulled from the BOLA as a reason for turning.
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Postby onlxn » Tue Oct 03, 2006 5:24 pm

Huh, interesting about the 21st. Sounds like Danielson's available, but he's probably not working many non-ROH dates these days with the bad shoulder. With Dragey/Arrogance already signed and a lot of guys unavailable, seems like we might see a KOW/Cape Fear rematch? Or maybe it's just Hero working singles. We shall see...

For the record, I'm not down on Friday's show. I don't like the booking of the one match, but the two tags should be great and Rocky/TJ should be solid. I actually really like the low-wattage cards, as it's cool to see the talented undercard guys get more of a spotlight. That's why I'm hoping we get another singles match underneath, so a guy like Bino or Nemesis could show off more of his stuff.
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Postby PsychoDriver » Tue Oct 03, 2006 6:37 pm

onlxn wrote:So says the dude who started a thread about how shitty one of PWG's workers is. And to reiterate, I fuckin' hate Petey. But it's silly to pretend that I'm the only one who criticizes aspects of the product.

PWG is indeed doing awesome at the moment, but we all have little things that bug us, and here's as good a place as any to discuss them. The promotion isn't going to be jeopardized by occasional criticism by some nyrdz on a message board, especially since those nyrdz all love the promotion and support it financially.


You need to calm down bro. Take it down a notch bro.
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Postby TigerDriver98 » Tue Oct 03, 2006 6:52 pm

Danielson could be a possibility for the 21st, he seems to back full time for ROH and FIP. Had the much hyped KAMALA match in LSW on Saturday and is working for CAPW this Sunday. American Dragon Vs. anyone would be good (AD Vs. Joey in a title defense could be a blast)

Or PWG could play Briscoe roulette again. But yeah, this is getting ahead of ourselves. I'm sure we'll find all of this out on Friday.


As for the 6th, I think following BOLA, it's only natural this show wouldn't get a fair shake. It has some mighty big shoes to fill. I know a few people who aren't going because they "don't like the card" for whatever reason. But that's fine, the bright side is that the building will be much more bearable without them.

The card is looks fine IMO. The tag matches should be great, HT-Joey should be fun, Rocky-TJ is always good, Rance/Ronin... well, I don't know enough about Rance to really say.

And I think Frankie Vs. Sky/Jade has alot of potential. First Blood has never been my favorite stipulation but I think it'll be a fun brawl.

Jade in the match makes sense, as they tried to ban her at BOLA... but it didn't work. So may as well make her apart of the match if she wants to get involved so much. I see her being only marginally involved in the match (pretty much like she has been lately anyway) I doubt Frankie will go Abdullah the Butcher on her and start carving her up with the scissors or anything ghastly. Jade is more likely to bust Frankie open with something then the other way around. If anything she'll maybe take a Wave of the future or something simple. It's wrestling, no one will read anything more into it.

It probably won't end the feud though (when has a First Blood match ever?) but it'll be fun. I just hope it doesn't use the old... "good guy makes the heel bleed, ref bump! Heel wipes the blood away, makes the face bleed somehow... ref wakes up sees the other guy bleeding and calls for the bell" Heck, maybe even a draw would work here.

We'll see, I'm looking forward to it on Friday...
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Postby guerrillamark » Wed Oct 04, 2006 9:01 am

I think Frankie/Jade/Sky is going to be really good actually. I'm really into this fued and looking forward to seeing where its going to go. I'm looking forward to the whole show actually. I think it's going to be one of those great under rated shows. And PLEASE bring back Los Luchas !!!
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Postby steven keen » Fri Oct 06, 2006 4:12 pm

off work and headed to the show. hope to see you all there!!!

i predict new tag champs and about 250 draw.

see you in a couple hours!!!

:twisted: :twisted: :twisted:
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